Former governor Madeleine Kunin still recoils at a male opponent’s claim that, as she recalls it, he’d be “more pro-female than me.”
When Kunin, Vermont’s first — and, to this day, only — female governor, ran for reelection in 1986, Burlington mayor Bernie Sanders told voters that he would do more for women if they replaced her with him.
“He claimed to be a better feminist than I was,” Kunin said this week in an interview with Seven Days. “It shocked me at the time.”
Sanders, now a U.S. senator seeking the presidency, has faced heightened scrutiny over his views on women in politics since CNN reported Monday that he’d declared in a private meeting that a woman could not win the White House in 2020. The other participant in the December 2018 meeting, Sen. Elizabeth Warren (D-Mass.), confirmed the report.
“Among the topics that came up was what would happen if Democrats nominated a female candidate,” said Warren, who is also running for president. “I thought a woman could win; he disagreed.”
Sanders has denied the story. “Well, as a matter of fact, I didn’t say it,” Sanders responded when asked about the alleged remark at a Democratic debate Tuesday in Des Moines, Iowa. “Anybody knows me knows that it’s incomprehensible that I would think that a woman cannot be president of the United States.”
Kunin, whose path to power in the 1980s coincided and sometimes conflicted with Sanders’, doesn’t believe her former rival. “As far as the conversation between he and Elizabeth Warren, I tend to believe her, since she’s been such a straight arrow on everything else,” Kunin said.
Sanders’ campaign did not respond to requests for comment.
The former governor has previously criticized Sanders over his approach to the 1986 race.
“When Sanders was my opponent he focused like a laser beam on ‘class analysis,’ in which ‘women’s issues’ were essentially a distraction from more important issues,” Kunin wrote in a Boston Globe op-ed at the height of his 2016 campaign for the presidency. “He urged voters not to vote for me just because I was a woman. That would be a ‘sexist position,’ he declared.” (Prior to writing the op-ed, Kunin had endorsed Sanders’ rival for the Democratic nomination, former secretary of state Hillary Clinton.)
In her 1994 memoir, Living a Political Life, Kunin recalled a rally in Burlington’s City Hall Park the weekend before the 1986 election. According to her husband, who attended the rally in her place, Sanders proclaimed that she had done nothing for women.
Archival newspaper accounts confirm that “women’s issues,” as they were referred to at the time, came up repeatedly during the 1986 campaign.
That September, according to an Associated Press story from the time, Sanders held a press conference to tout his “women’s program.” That included increased funding for childcare centers and educational opportunities for women. He also touted his work as mayor supporting a domestic abuse shelter, job training for women, and a prohibition on housing discrimination against women with children.
“I am extremely proud of my record as the chief executive of the city of Burlington in supporting women’s rights,” he told reporters at the press conference. “If elected governor … I will continue to actively support the rights of women in all areas of our society.”
Days later, at a state convention of the National Organization for Women, all three candidates — Democrat Kunin, Republican Peter Smith and independent Sanders — declared their support for the Equal Rights Amendment. Kunin took the opportunity to defend her record, arguing that she had sought to close the pay gap between men and women in state government, founded a new program to help women get off welfare and hired a gender-diverse staff and cabinet.
“My whole political career has been the personification of the ERA,” she said, according to a Rutland Herald account.
The topic turned testy during a debate in late October when Sanders alleged that Kunin had not done enough to increase the availability of childcare.
“Sanders has made his record on women’s issues as mayor of Burlington into a cornerstone of his campaign,” the Herald reported at the time. “He has sought to show he would do more for women than has Kunin, the state’s first female governor. As part of his platform, Sanders has said major increases in funding for day care are needed to allow more women — especially single mothers — to work.”
Kunin’s response? “Bernie, I would just like to do one thing and that is to stick to the issues and stick to the facts and not question my honesty on any of these issues,” she said during the debate.
In one interview that year, according to Burlington journalist and activist Greg Guma’s book, The People’s Republic, Sanders dismissed Kunin as a lightweight.
“If you ask her where she stands she’d say, in the middle of the Democratic party,” Sanders said in the interview. “She’s never said she’d do anything. The confusion lies in the fact that many people are excited because she’s the first woman governor. But after that there ain’t much.”
In the end, Kunin won reelection with 47 percent of the vote. Smith claimed 38 percent and Sanders took just 14 percent. Four years later, Sanders would defeat Smith to win a seat in Congress.
Kunin, now 86 years old, says she’s disappointed that the country is still debating whether a woman could win the presidency. “It’s unfortunately a question in the air, but I think we can prove the answer is yes,” she said.
That doesn’t mean she’s determined who she’ll support in Vermont’s March 3 presidential primary. “No, I haven’t,” she said. “I’m waiting to see how this sugars off.”
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Yes, Senator Warren has “been such a straight arrow on everything else”… well, except for that whole Native American ancestry thing. Be that as it may, there is a difference between saying a woman “could” be elected and a woman “should” be elected. If Bernie was saying a Warren (or any women in general) “couldn’t” get elected, that isn’t necessarily that inflammatory. If he was saying she “shouldn’t” get elected, that is entirely different.
Madeleine Kunin believes Warren over Bernie? When Warren has been spewing lie after lie. Lie#1 Claiming she has American Indian heritage on her application for the state bar in Texas , #2 claiming her children attended public schools #3 claiming her father was a janitor #4 she was the first woman to be post partum and breast feeding to sit for the bar exam #5 she plagiarized recipes for a Cherokee cookbook from the NYT claiming to have been handed down in her family. Need I go on.
The CNN article has been largely criticized for use of anonymous sources and misrepresentation of who was really in the room for this conversation which took place 2 years ago. Why not do an article on the Slant/Bias coming from CNN, and why they’re trying to manufacture division between the two most competent progressives we’ve ever seen in the mainstream?
https://www.rollingstone.com/politics/political-commentary/january-democratic-debate-2020-cnn-bernie-sanders-elizabeth-warren-938365/
Open your eyes, Paul.
>Kunin, now 86 years old, says she’s disappointed that the country is still debating whether a woman could win the presidency.
No one is debating whether a woman can win the presidency. That’s a deeply dishonest framing of the debate. The question revolves around whether or not Bernie *said* a woman cannot win the presidency. Those two things are extremely, extremely different. By framing it the way you have in this article, you’re continuing the smear attacks begun by 2016 that takes Warren at her word and assumes Bernie actually said that, of which there is no proof.
Of course, why am I surprised that 7D is smearing Bernie? Why am I surprised 7D is trying to get national attention, again, by dragging Bernie through the mud? Seems to be the only way you guys can keep the lights on.
Kunin’s contempt for Bernie’s use of class analysis as the grounding for his politics tells you all you ever need or needed to know about Kunin. Feminism isn’t about making one woman governor (or President) it’s about the liberation of women as a (part of the working) class.
“I tend to believe her, since she’s been such a straight arrow on everything else,” Kunin said.”…Ummm….
Bernie is widely known for his integrity and even right wing political commentators who don’t agree with any of his policies don’t question his integrity. Bernie is a straight arrow and he just isn’t someone who makes up stories or changes his positions to pander to this audience or that. That’s just the case.
Hey. Look. For a candidate to say that he or she can do better on any issue is what campaigning is all about. If I am running for President against Trump, I would say I could do better on this or that, and if I were running against a woman, it would be perfectly o. k. to say that I could do a better job for women’s rights than my opponent. Being a woman and a candidate does not equal being a strong advocate for women’s rights. Isn’t that obvious? This whole thing is a non-issue. It is ridiculous. What was Bernie supposed to say, when he ran against Kunin? Was he supposed to say that he could not do as good a job for women’s rights? The press cooks stuff like this up to bias voters and to sell their media.
What is the point of publishing this article other than to illustrate what a weasel Paul Heintz is and what a rag Seven Days is becoming? Dredging up a 35 year old disagreement or misunderstanding between Bernie Sanders and Madeline Kunin is transparently designed to discredit Bernie, it has no merit and Heintz, you are an effing jerk.
Ah, the Bernie Bros are our in force!
For a man with so much supposed integrity, Sanders sure has a long pattern of letting his campaign staff make the dirty attacks for him while he plays the surprised and somehow un-involved-in-his-own-campaign candidate. Didn’t that “rogue staffer” behind the anti-Warren script turn out to have been the actual campaign operation itself? You know, the one full of 2016 Jill Stein voters like his speechwriter Sirota and his spokesperson Gray?
Such integrity. A rather bigly amount, you might even say.
I’m not a Warren supporter.
But You can tell just by the body language of both Warren and Bernie that he made a gaff, and warren rightfully called him out on it.
The Bernie Supporters are upset that warren spoke up, and they would rather have her shut up, lose the election, stay home and bake cookies rather than defend herself.
Oh the progressives and their hypocrisy.
Bernie has surged in tonights new post-debate polls. Lol. Warrens slimy stunt failed, and it was Warren who plummeted. Lol. Nobody trusts the media, and one-sided articles like this are exactly why. Bernie is about to run away with this nomination and it wont be close. One poll tonight had him surge past Biden. Again, CNN and the corrupt media tried so hard to smear him, and he actually rose multiple points in the polls. Lol. You cant make this up.
straight arrow…. are we sure she wasn’t a cheap shot at Warren? Lol. Jk…She said with no irony tho…or awareness that warren has one of the greater reputations for lying, while Sanders is widely considered to be the most honest politician in Congress… Warren went to the gutter by leaking the manipulated story, confirming the story with cnn which she leaked earlier, and then trying to say Bernie said no woman could win, ever. Lol. Oh, you liar. She didnt even say vs trump or 2020. Warren went for the most gutter politics as possible. And now shes plummeting in the new post-debate polls because of it. And I read WaPo reports where Warrens aides admitted she was embellishing. Go figure.
I really look forward to making this lady vote Bernie Sanders for President in November 2020. You can feel the envy. Even she will have him be her President. That said, cheers to her. Beyond her being a useful-fool for the corrupt elites and DNC cronies trying to hurt his working class movement against the status-quo Establishment.
The environment, the economy, impeachment and the federal government, loss of civil governance, and more … yet Seven Days, VTDigger and more insist on spending tons of “print” on this stupid story.
Keep up the good work, Paul. The online misogynistic thug-army only proves that women are just supposed to stay in their place as the Ladies Auxiliary, at best. You gotta love the one woke commenter*s reference to Warren as *this lady.*
I stopped reading this article when they quoted someone calling Warren a “straight arrow on everything else.”
Of all the major points to be debated, this is a point that the media, led by Jeff Zyucker’s CNN has decided to promote.
Just keep in mind, here’s two leading Dem candidates for Prez, and at least one of them is lying.
If he had been quicker on his feet he would have espoused how thrilled he would be if Americans voted in a fake Native American president as long as she has the intention to pay attention to how the Repugs do not give a flying you know what about working folks.I am so looking forward to when no one (except those he pays) bothers to go to the Chumpish shrine after he dumps them all with a ‘Do not need anymore’ sign.
Congrats Paul for this . Next you should run a hard hitting exposé on how Bernie believed he was the best stick-ball player in Brooklyn in the 50’s .
A lot of angry berners out there.
The crabapples don’t fall far from the tree
Bernie’s guilty! #Believethewomanregardlessofeverything
This is such a joke, Sanders is so honest, a straight guy.. Is there’s another bernie sanders?? Because the sanders I know is a lying crook, a woman-hater. Remember the paper he wrote that women like being raped, they beg to be raped, they fantasize of being gang-raped. YES he wrote that. !!! He is a LIAR, a dirty low down snake in the grass liar. He told me my husband wasn’t in Vietnam that he was never in the ARMY that my husband lied to me. as most wannabes do. This from a DRAFT DODGER !!! Then how come I have all my husband records and medals??? I made copies of his records and threw them into sanders face, and this liar who hates the Military wants to be our Commander-in-Chief. He’ll be bought off again like he was in 2016. The socialist like his money to much. Now that he’s worth millions he doesn’t trash millionaires anymore..
I was the head of the Burlington Women’s Council for a decade. I worked with Bernie when he was Mayor and he did do more for women than Madeliene Kunin. The Women’s Council did more with our little budget than the Governor’s commission. We instituted a Women in the Trades program that taught women construction trades where they could make a decent wage, it continues as Vermont Works for Women. At the time some lib Dems thought beauty school was more appropriate. The City paid for self-defense classes for women and girls and people with disabilities.
Kunin says she was all about the ERA but she contributed to its non-passage in Vermont. When the first headline about the ERA in the Freep is Madeliene Kunin Says Ellie Smeal Stay Out of Vermont, you know a campaign that needs women’s solidarity and NOW’s help is already in trouble with this divisive and dumb message from the top. The statewide group to get it passed was run by centrist Dems who refused to admit the feminist base into its highly selective ranks and weighted the votes of organizations by loyalty to Democratic centrism. Additionally the group would not allow even internal discussion of abortion and gay marriage though we knew this would be a focus of the right. In my opinion her strategy or lack of it is why we lost the ERA in Vermont.
Vermont ratified the ERA in 1973, the year after its introduction.
Ahh once again, people can’t take Bernie’s stark honesty in this phony “can’t-handle-the-truth” society we live-in.
A LOT of sour grapes here. In Kunin’s defense, if I were the female candidate and my opponent made (the totally true) statement that voting for a woman simply because she’s a woman is sexist, I would also get my panties in a twist, any woman would on the face of it. I don’t blame her for getting upset or hating on Sanders, it’s an understandable, natural reaction.
However, having a successful political career & the distinction of being the ONLY woman to ever be elected governor in the state, speaks volumes for Kunin. The only reason to dredge up a 35 y/o issues disagreement, & alleged political smear, is to capitalize on the Warren fiasco and try to “damage” Sanders. It’s as transparent as the Warren campaign’s 11th hour “gotcha” maneuver. Not very classy Governor.
As usual the fact don’t agree with the accusations: in an apples to apples comparison of the issues (from what’s written) it appears that Bernie did do more for women, as Mayor, than Kunin. She would also be angry if he (a man) had showed her (a woman) up in these circumstances, so there’s that. If we’re being honest, I’m going to say: money for childcare is more immediate & direct assistance to mothers who need it, than an elusive Equal Rights Amendment, even though both are important.
People love to hate on Bernie, without much substance. This reads as just another hit piece. Haters will love it, because well…haters. More importantly, the rest of us will see through it.
1. I do not agree with Ms. Boutin on just about anything, because I am a moderate. But unlike Mr. Oracle, I do not believe that only pro-Bernie, pro-Zuckerman, pro-Prog commenters should be allowed to live in the Seven Days neighborhood.
2. I have disagreed with Mr. Greenberg about many things. But kudos to Mr. Greenberg for pointing out the astounding factual error of a pro-Bernie, anti-Kunin, anti-Democrat commenter about Vermont’s adoption of the ERA.
This is an absolutely absurd article and really sad that Seven Days is poking a non-existent issue. Bernie has done far more for vulnerable populations (including women within those communities) than many female politicians and leaders.
There isn’t an issue here and if you’d like some better reading on the topic, try this: https://jacobinmag.com/2020/01/bernie-sand…
Just because an article in a marxist magazine that adores Bernie Sanders and despises Elizabeth Warren, has decided that Bernie never said what he is accused of saying, does not make it so. Just because the article has decided that this issue is just is the “centrist Democrats” being against Bernie, does not make it so (Warren hardly represents the “centrists” or the “establishment” of the Democratic Party). This is just another example of Bernie and his supporters, who hate the Democratic Party but at the same time desperately want its nomination, playing the victim.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jacobin_(mag…
So the headline should be something along the lines of “right wing former female governor, closely aligned with Hillary Clinton and Margaret Thatcher, tries to use identity politics to smear Bernie Sanders, her former rival.”
Yes, being a woman is swell, but it doesn’t make your policies benefit other women.
I think that the women of Libya right now are not singing the praises of secretary Hillary Clinton buried who Kunin voted for And clearly is still bitterly supporting.
“So the headline should be something along the lines of “right wing former female governor,”
OMG. Another zombie from Planet Bro heard from. There was and is absolutely nothing “right wing” about Madeline Kunin. There is, however, plenty of evidence of Bernie’s disrespect for women and general meanness, which is also practiced by his army of online thugs.
BTW, Gov. Kunin is not a “former female.” She remains a female to this day. Perhaps you means “female former Governor.”